Curiosity

I have been thinking of the same thing for the past 2 weeks or so. I agree with you that emergence is based a lot much on perspective. Since everyone looks at things from different perspectives, I feel as if anything could be an emergent system if one looked at it from a particular perspective. When I am feeling philosophical, I notice patterns in things that I would not otherwise. Which then is the correct perspective? Or is there a correct perspective at all? The difinition of emergence is so simple and general that it does not exclude anything as long as it involves making complex things out of simple rules. Is that the point then? To make everything so general so that everything is nicely connected?

I also have been looking feeling the same way as you two. I though am trying so hard to find the bigger picture because I feel like if it just seems to easy to try and have everything fit this same type of pattern even though it does not. Everything seems to have become complexed based on simple things. Any and everything I can fathom, I seem to see as emergence and I am just trying to really grasp the true meaning behind all of this. I guess that is where I am having a difficult time. I just seem to want an aswer, even though there really is not one and we are all in some what the same position. Sometimes I get the feeling that I am just completely lost within understanding this whole picture, but then I always go back to the basics and simplest forms. But what happens when you do not know what is the basic and simplest form? Today I worked on NetLogo with Jesse in class trying to see if we could figure out how the big picture worked and of course, we went to the procedures page. What I find difficult is trying to sort through the information on my own, but with Jesse's help it was a lot easier. It helped me so much today to grasp the ideas behind the model because I had another persons opinion and views. I think it is really important that we take advantage of eachother because there is so much to learn from eachother. There were times when Jesse and I were not even sure of what we were doing, but we began to just piece through it with eachothers perspectives on what might happen or why something happened. I found that working with another person helped me get over my natural instincts to try and find an answer, and helped me just take things piece by piece and appreaciate it for what it is.

On the topic of perspective, one of the things that I have been worrying about is how much of emergence as a whole is just perspective. One of the possible applications of emergence that I have been thinking about is its use in cosmology, particularly in explaining the structure of the universe. However, computer models that make use of only gravity have produced the filamentary structure that is present on the largest scale on which the universe isn't homogeneous (about 100 Mpc). Is this computer model just demonstrating an emergent property of the universe? I don't think that the writers of these models think of it from an "emergent perspective", but that doesn't mean that it's not there. On the other hand, take the structure of galaxies, and in particular spiral galaxies. When many spirals turned out to have a "bar" in the center (rather than a blob/sphere), the question was, "what could give rise to this?" It was later shown, mathematically, that the only way to prevent a bar from forming is to include much more matter in a halo around the galaxy that is not observed--the infamous dark matter (and this is only one piece of evidence for DM). My question is, is this barred structure emergent? I would tend to say no, since it can be explained (and indeed predicted) mathematically. Up until now, we've (or at least, I've) taken Paul's word when he says that many of the things that we are studying with emergence can't be solved analytically, with perhaps a reference to Godel's Incompleteness thrown in there. Must this always be the case for emergence? And if it is always the case (and maybe even if it isn't), does that make emergenece a satisfying answer, philosophically? In philosophy, today, we were discussing the difference between an explanation and a justification, as it relates to Hume's Enquiry. It seems that with no predictive power, emergence is relegated to an explanation, which, while useful, does not seem to be ultimately satisfying. Ideas?